Would you completely renovate 2 bathrooms to make room for a hallway
Hey hope everyone is doing well. Looking to add an addition to second floor but running into a design issue. House is very narrow about 20’ I have a second floor with 2 bedrooms and 2 baths. In order to add an extra bedroom upstairs I would have to create a hallway that runs in between both bathrooms and a bedroom. The bedroom is currently 11’x11’ with a 3feet hall the bedroom would become 8’11’ My wife is saying that it would be too small to be a bedroom. I just think it would be a small bedroom but fine for a kid. Everyone telling me that setup would never work because it’s too small. I grew up my whole life in an apartment so doesn’t seem as crazy to me. 1 bathroom is set up that I can make a smaller vanity and make the bathroom 1.5’ft more narrow. But the bathroom adjacent I would have to move the toilet and redesign the whole setup. It is only 3’x8’ and needs a lot of work but either way it would create more work for me now to make it more narrow. I could combine both baths and make 1 large one. I could also not make a hallway, add the extra bedroom and renovate the whole setup when kids are older and need more privacy (oldest one is 5)
Lastly I could make the addition on side of home but then I would have to escavate the side of the home that is on a slope. Seems easier to add on to back.
What would you do?
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A sketch would be helpful to get good ideas
As a kid I had a 9'9" sq bedroom and kids spend a lot of time in their rooms, so I say do not skimp on bedroom space.
In my current house the downstairs [kids] bath was very small and quirky. The hall ran only to the laundry/utility room. I expanded the bath to take over the hall and added a double vanity[two girls] and linen closet. The shower and toilet remained separate and closed off by an opaque glass door. You can still walk around to get to the laundry without cutting through the bath.
Personally I think hallways and bathrooms are space wasters. I see giant baths in houses and ask 'why?' Space better used for rooms you spend more time in.
2 baths for 2 bedrooms?
I design a lot of renovations and it's funny how often existing bathrooms are in the way of a hallway that would make the redesign work best. As a kid I had a tiny bedroom, maybe 7x10, and even as an adult I've had multiple bedrooms in the 9x11 range. But 8x11 is pretty small, even for a kid.
If you post the design here, we would be able to better able to advise you.
Kids only need tiny bedrooms, they're tiny people. By the time they need bigger rooms they're off to college.
I'm in the land of 15' and 18' lots so 20' feels pretty roomy. My current bedroom is 8.5'x12' and it is big enough for queen bed with end tables, bassinet and changing table. I know everything is bigger in US but the idea that 8x11 is too small for a kids rooms feels silly to me.
One option to leave it as is and access the extension through the existing room. When it is time (or energy) to redo the bathroom you can build a hallway there by taking a bit of space for a bedroom and the bath. You can fit a 4 piece bath into 5'x6' so It should be doable to re-shuffle things.
Wow, 5x6 would be tight. I think of 5x8 as the norm, I have one bathroom that's 5x7 and it's cozy. The vanity is 24", the tub is 30", there's a couple of inches between the vanity and tub and 27" left for the toilet. The swing of the door practically takes up half the room.
I know it might sound tight but it works well.
You can't use a 24" vanity, max is 18". With the smaller vanity you have plenty (by plenty I mean just enough) of space for the toilet and the walking area in front is still decent. The door swing is not an issue as the door is closed when in a bath is in use. You still have a decent wall area open for a towel rack and I like to put hangers on the back of the door as well. Except for a medicine cabinet no room for storage though.
Here is a rough sketch of what the current layout is. I could get into more detail with measurements but looking at what my best approach would be. I have 2 baths on 1st floor. An old bathroom I was planning on turning into an office. I have 2 bathrooms because it was an unfinished renovation. My logic is to build out the back from the basement/patio level where I have a deck now because the land is flat. I also had work done on side of home to devert water away. Building out the side seems like much more work and excavation especially since it on a slope. As Akos said I could add the addition and worry about restructuring the bathrooms later.
What if you made the addition two bedrooms and made the existing bedroom into a hall/common area? Leave the existing baths. Instead of putting closets into the new bedrooms put built-in storage in the common area.
Or make the smaller bathroom into a closet for one of the new bedrooms and put a new bathroom alongside the existing larger bathroom, taking the space of the bedroom. The rest of the bedroom can provide a closet for the other new bedroom, a hall, and a linen closet in the hall.
Some variation of this is the way, I think.
Without a scale on the drawing, it's hard to envision perfectly, but it would seem putting two bedrooms in the addition gets them both at approx. 10' width, which could be workable.
Assuming your 20 ft width, if the addition is 12-14 feet long, you will have two perfectly acceptable bedrooms with closet space. Leave the existing bedroom open as a sitting area with closets. This is especially nice if the two new bedrooms end up on the small side. As kids get older, it is nice to have a place where they can be with friends or alone that is not where you are
All great ideas, thank you. If I can leave everything as is the addition will simple be a square for 2 bedrooms on second floor, a square dining room on first, and a square basement room. Less invasive, no movement of plumbing or knocking down walls. I’m assuming this is a less costly addition but I don’t know where this would even go with price. Even the basement level is mainly above ground. Only potential issues I see is that the second floor is 8 feet short compared to first floor. Not sure if there will be major changes to support the second floor suspended over the original house and addition. 2nd I’m too close to my neighbor on right side town would have to allow me a variance to extend it further back following the existing footprint
couple points
time flies, do now what you will want. the kids will be in college in about 15 minutes
sometimes complicated is easier.
once you start knocking walls down it clears the mind, and you get what you want
a pair of 5x7 bathrooms no matter the perceived complexity simplifies the floorplan
not to be fussy but your sketches are sketchy, up and down don't match
good info gets good advice
I think they're rotated 180 degrees relative to each other, if you flip one around the stairs line up. If you look at the second picture, my take is he wants to bump the second floor out to align with the first and then add on to both where the deck is now.
Agree that time flies!
I attached a more detailed floor plan. Interior seems to be closer to 19’ must be 20’ wide before walls. My goal is to add a bedroom with the least disruption and cost. My wife would like to keep at least 2 bathrooms, she wants kids to have a separate bath. Trying to see some good input on design that would be economical. I also have a detached 2 car garage that takes up the small backyard. Seeing if I can either add that to side of addition or to keep it detached but move it further up so it’s not in my backyard. I took a picture of the front roof line. There’s a small part of roof that for some reason was not part of dormer that takes up real estate on second floor (bedroom has a useless corner) the rear roof line and the side where addition can go as well. My original thought is add everything to back don’t touch the interior layout at all. Not sure if that is most economical way to go. On rear roof I have 8ft on original house footprint. In other words if I can squeeze in space on second floor it would not require a new foundation. Thank you as always for your input, always found this forum helpful
So:
Your small bath is not 'to code' you need min 4' inside the walls to have clearance in front of toilet[21 inches min]. If you were willing to pay the freight to replumb, you could make two small, but yet nice baths, and maybe take up less space. The other side is that if you don't touch the small bath, it does not need to be fixed for inspection.
two bedrooms in the addition would still be small, but hey, it is not a big house. Small bedrooms for kids can be made up for by using that former bedroom as a public space so older kids don't need to stay in their rooms and still have a place to be. You can steal some space from this area for the right bedroom[in your drawing] and other closet space. Still room for a small couch, TV, stereo, gaming...whatever kids do
...and downstairs, smaller, nicer half bath rather than 3rd full bath, free up space for other things.......
Thanks, all helpful pointers. The last thought I have is to add a bath across from the large one. (Added drawing) Not sure how hard it is to have plumbing on the opposite side of house but that would free up space that I could use 8ft on the existing foundation and not need to build an addition on new footing. However I would be losing that common area for kids. What I’m basically asking which typically costs more:
1. Adding an addition with new space and foundation and finding an entrance from old to new or
2. Remodeling an existing footprint but doing major repairs/alteration removing walls, plumbing to change layout
Might I add to my knowledge I would still need drawings permit to extend my second floor 8feet on existing foundation
Just curious if anyone has an opinion on what would be easiest and cheapest way to add a bedroom here. I have 8 foot on second floor to line up with end of first floor as you can see in picture. Not sure if there is a way to set up the second floor layout with that amount of space to squeeze in a 3rd bedroom. This would entail shoring up my foundation I wouldn’t be building any additional foundation. My other option is to close in my rear deck that is 14x20. I could either just have a bedroom off of rear of kitchen, I already have a first floor full bath. I could also make the first floor my dining room and second floor can have 2 small but descent size bedrooms as suggested in previous post. Finally if I could somehow cantilever any feet off the second floor I could add maybe 10 feet out instead of 8. That would make a huge difference.
Sorry for all the babbling just trying to find a solution that won’t set me out of budget. Any 3 bedroom house in my current area would cost another 450k on top of what I owe at least so it would be worth to at least improve what I have.
My sister's room was growing up was about 8x10; worked fine. Use showers in the baths; they take less room and no one uses tubs anyway. Or put the two BRs in the addition like was suggested and have a hall with a small sitting area for a kids study or TV area.
"and no one uses tubs anyway."
Except for all the people who use tubs...
yeah, like people with kids...
Hey just revisiting my post seeing if anyone can give me a little design advice. The first floor is kind of oddly laid out. I’m thinking is there a way to add a bedroom to the first floor using most of the floor plan I have now it may be cheaper than redesigning the second floor. A contracter told me the higher you go up the more expensive it gets. So I would end up with 2 bedrooms upstairs, 1 downstairs. The upstairs would not need to be touched and I can leave as is. I have 2 bathrooms downstairs so don’t mind ripping either out if it helps design. Or make 1 much smaller like a powder room. Just can’t grasp how you would have a bedroom close to your kitchen without it being too weird.